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Stephen Kinzer: The Dulles Brothers

Dulles Brothers Stephen Kinzer

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#1 Stan Wilbourne

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 01:36 AM

 

I'd be interested to hear what members have to say about this interview with Stephen Kinzer on the Dulles Brothers.

 

He comes to an interesting conclusion on Allen Dulles' involvement in the assassination of JFK.

 

Kinzer also appears to believe the Dulles Duo was working in a bubble, away from the machinery of power.  :lol:

 

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#2 Phil Dragoo

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 04:40 PM

Christopher Lydon's breathless depiction prompts a similar hysterical tone in author Stephen Kinzer largely absent from the book which I have, which I recommend.

 

Strictly prescriptive is too much to ask, and the judgmental creeps in around the edges yet the Dulles method is the key to understanding the mid-Twentieth Century role of America in the world arena.

 

We were prepared by Gerard Colby and Charlotte Dennett, Thy Will Be Done: The Conquest of the Amazon: Nelson Rockefeller and Evangelism in the Age of Oil, as well as by Donald Gibson, Battling Wall Street: The Kennedy Presidency, and George Michael Evica, A Certain Arrogance.

 

The Dulles brothers had the world under its Christmas tree; other boys, a model railroad, a bicycle, a six-shooter with a roll of caps.  Tutored by secretaries of state, doing drills at Versailles, lawyers to the rich and infamous, taken up in the OSS wash cycle of WW II and ready for the rinse of CIA.

 

Truman was prevailed upon in 1948 to secretly amend the 1947 National Defense Act giving CIA duties beyond intelligence coordination which he would publicly regret December 1963.

 

Iran in 1953, Guatemala in 1954 and it is on June 23 of that year that Eisenhower showed himself on the Dulles team in a way diametrically opposed to Kennedy:

 

"Air power coud be decisive,"  Allen's men on the scene told him in an urgent cable on June 23.

 

Within hours, Allen was in the Oval Office.  He explained the situation and asked Eisenhower to authorize immediate deployment of several air force planes to Nicaragua, where the dictator, Anastasio Somoza, would release them for use in PB/Success.  When he was finished, Henry Holland, the State Department's legal adviser, presented the contrary case, arguing that further bombing would violate international law and promote anti-Americanism.  Eisenhower decided in Allen's favor, and the planes were deployed.  Later he told one of his close military comrades, General Andrew Goodpaster, that it was an easy choice.

 

"If you at any time take the route of violence or support of violence,"  He said, Then you commit yourself to carry it through, and it's too late to have second thoughts."

 

There is a seamless religio-political-corporate Fosterianism which Reston of the Times mocks but was the Way, just as Delano-messianism had preceded and the great rebranding beginning with Dick and Henry's Excellent Adventure ushered in the Faux Fall of the Iron Curtain and the Potemkin Reform of Chinese Communism.

 

The Dulles role in the JFK Assassination is not speculative as Lydon and Kinzer insist, but organic, intuitive, incontrovertible.

 

Michael Calder, JFK vs. CIA, 2000, names Helms as chief facilitator.  John Newman states Angleton as the primary Oswald legend librettist.  Bissell would be involved per the role of his position.  The Bay of Pigs as a provocation designed to implode and tar Kennedy with traitor blowback, create a regiment of motivated Cuban-CIA assassins.

 

Is it outre?  At mid-book we have Dulles Brothers' Lansdale in Vietnam moving Catholics south and raising up a Catholic interloper whom we will see Lansdale removing and Hunt forging cables framing Kennedy for assassinating.

 

Kinzer keeps telling Lydon he doesn't find it in his research, doesn't find evidence or proof.

 

The pair posit perhaps plausible denial still in effect.

 

Perhaps the Newtonian precepts have not yet been supplanted by string theory, Schroder's Cat still more than a smile.

 

Prescriptive commentary muddies rather than clarifies the descriptive which is all the evidence needed.

 

In the tsunami of circumstantial evidence presented by the author Allen Dulles is thumbs down to the waiting gladiators as Foster concurs as a mute shade.

 

And lest the smug and smarmy see an end to it with the death of the Dulles brothers, let them read Compromised: Clinton, Bush and the CIA, Terry Reed and John Cummings, 1994, and see future presidents George H.W. Bush and Willam J. Clinton colluding in a war illegal under the Boland Amendment for anti-Communism and the drug trade those twin motives tweaked for Afghanistan which is prepared for stall by the Obama-Hillary visits to Burma.

 

Let them explain CIA/NATO Arab Spring, Benghazi as CIA gunrunning to alleged Islamist devil enemies in the so-called War On Terror in the downstream of the Towering Reichstag of 2001.

 

Gates to Leahy, "Senator, all governments lie to each other.  It's how business gets done."  I would add, they lie to their citizens after lying to themselves.

 

Sandy Serrano is uncomfortable doing a photo lineup for Greg Parker forty-six years after witnessing the polkadot dress girl proclaim, "We killed him!"

 

Yet Morley and Kinzer don't have the evidence.

 

Does it reside in a box of files on a shelf in the labyrinthine warehouse of Raiders of the Lost Ark or in the cascading deductions roaring over the rocks of regime change in the white water of our lives.


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#3 Stan Wilbourne

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Posted 25 March 2014 - 09:32 PM

Yet Morley and Kinzer don't have the evidence.

 

Does it reside in a box of files on a shelf in the labyrinthine warehouse of Raiders of the Lost Ark or in the cascading deductions roaring over the rocks of regime change in the white water of our lives.

 

 

The Dulles brothers had the world under its Christmas tree; other boys, a model railroad, a bicycle, a six-shooter with a roll of caps.  Tutored by secretaries of state, doing drills at Versailles, lawyers to the rich and infamous, taken up in the OSS wash cycle of WW II and ready for the rinse of CIA.

 

 

 

Phil, all very well said.  The Dulles Brothers were the CEOs of the corporate war machine.  They served the war machine.  They didn't control it.  It controlled them.  They're just the whores with a certain price tag, which I don't see as having anything to do with Calvinism.

 

Mr. Kinser, step up to the plate and take another swing.



#4 Jim Hackett II

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 11:43 PM

Kinser's book: worth a read but ....

 

While it is true the book Kinser wrote manufactures deniability to some extent, as hard as it is to find good data about the Dulles Brothers, I am glad I have this title and I too recommend it to other researchers.

Compared to Mosley's "Dulles" much more is covered in Kinser's book. Cave-Brown's 2 books "Bodyguard of Lies" and "Donovan" scratched around on the top of the sand too within limits.

 

As other said though, I encourage a little critical thinking most especially when encountering the Dulles Brothers and those of that ilk. It had been long established to my satisfaction that Angleton, Phillips and Helms were directly involved in the Fable side of the November Coup no matter what any author writes....

 

"They all knew". LFProuty.

 

Well we all know now too.

 

FWIW

Jim



#5 Robert Harper

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Posted 01 September 2014 - 12:17 PM

i also found Kinser's book invaluable as an up-to-date report of the brothers Dulles. I'm amazed that any emphasis on the concepts of brothers-in power is still associated with the brothers Kennedy. But the latter had less than 3 years at the helm. The brothers Dulles had 8 years at the helm and 40 other years, close by.They headed a State department as well as what was called a state department for unfriendly nations (CIA). They were mouthpieces of the self-proclaimed elite; they merged business interests and consolidated trans-national corporations and propped up the Nazi intelligence service for use of Americans against the Soviets - and Americans against Americans.

 

One has to spend a bit of time reading through the JFK material to see how central they are to the nexus described, in various ways, by Anthony Sutton, Donald Gibson Jim Marrs, Russ Baker and he essays of Lisa Pearse, among others. I used to think that Carl Ogelsby's distinction of "yankees" (the northeast financial Mayflowerish crowd) and the "cowboys" (the southwest financial oil crowd) exchanging places on Nov 22 1963 was the most apt synopsis of the event.

 

Now, I tend to think of the yankees (Harriman, Prescott Bush) as morphed into the cowboys (LBJ, Bush I & 2) since Dulles and Poppy Bush easily walked with each. They all reside at the same ponderosa - Wall Street-Langley-WashingtonDC.

 

Too bad we didn't have someone able to go after the underlings and get at the sponsors of the event.



#6 Greg Burnham

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Posted 02 September 2014 - 10:22 AM

Well said, Robert.


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