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Faces of Dealey Plaza

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#1 Stan Wilbourne

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 06:01 AM

Following up on the Charles Drago "Doppelganger Gambit " -

 

http://forum.assassi...e-photos/?p=108

 

Dallas, Texas.  November 22, 1963.   On the corner of Main and Houston, at 12:30 are these two interesting gentlemen:

 

It's been speculated the pair is William "Rip" Robertson and John Adrian O'Hare.

 

2hezqxt.jpg

 

I found this info on the duo on another site:

 

William 'Rip' Robertson served in the Marines during WW2 before joining the CIA. He was heavily involved in the overthrow of the Guatemalan government led by Jacob Arbenz, and commanded the ship Barbara J during the Bay of Pigs invasion. In the summer of 1963, Robertson was the CIA officer present on the Eddie Bayo, William Pawley led mission into Cuba known as Operation Tilt. Robertson was also on staff at JM/WAVE headquarters in Miami. Close associates of Robertson's were John Roselli and David Morales.

 

John Adrian O'Hare is a mysterious character whose true alliances remain somewhat of a mystery. He was military intelligence aide to Douglas MacArthur's army intelligence team during the Korean War. O'Hare also served under Charles Willoughby. He was involved with the original planning and training of Operation 40 personnel and was closely connected to several Cuban militants including Rolando Masferrer. Other names used by O'Hare included Col. William Bishop, Col. Richard Gray, P. Harrison and Oscar del Valle Garcia.

 

 

Thoughts?



#2 Charles Drago

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 01:51 PM

My Doppelganger Gambit construct may extend to encompass the Dealey Plaza Facilitator look-a-likes operation -- some of whom may be actual Facilitators or False Facilitators/Sponsors.

 

Confused yet?

 

Would highly astute, veteran intelligence officers involved in facilitating the assassination throw caution to the wind, ignore basic tradecraft, and place themselves -- in disguise or in the clear -- under countless camera lenses at the scene of the world-historic crime they had helped to set up?  

 

Perhaps.  Hubris is hubris.

 

OR

 

Might some/all of these individuals in fact not have been complicit in the crime but rather sent to the scene by the actual conspirators (as part of the tactic to create patsies and thus propagate a form of cognitive dissonance that would confuse generations of investigators) believing that they were to witness Operation Thespian (my copyrighted term, for lack of a better one), a staged, non-fatal attack on JFK that would serve as the causas belli for an invasion of Cuba -- at least -- only to realize that faux had morphed into foe?

 

My answer:

 

Yes.


"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#3 Charles Drago

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 09:59 PM

P.S. -- I see the Dallas operation most clearly and deeply when I appreciate it as, quite literally, a hybrid work of art -- brilliantly conceived, powerfully staged, darkly lit dramatic tragedy, if you will.  A collaborative effort.

 

And don't think for a nanosecond that the work wasn't signed.  

 

So in the final analysis, is it not fair to say that we're searching for the artists' signatures?

 

Pure if informed speculation:  Might the infamous Dealey Plaza umbrella be the signature of The Umbrella -- lifted directly from a gold bar?

 

Far-fetched?  Sterling Seagrave might not think so.


"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#4 Stan Wilbourne

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Posted 22 March 2014 - 08:57 AM

Might some/all of these individuals in fact not have been complicit in the crime but rather sent to the scene by the actual conspirators (as part of the tactic to create patsies and thus propagate a form of cognitive dissonance that would confuse generations of investigators) believing that they were to witness Operation Thespian (my copyrighted term, for lack of a better one), a staged, non-fatal attack on JFK that would serve as the causas belli for an invasion of Cuba -- at least -- only to realize that faux had morphed into foe?

 

 

And don't think for a nanosecond that the work wasn't signed. 

 

So in the final analysis, is it not fair to say that we're searching for the artists' signatures?

 

Pure if informed speculation:  Might the infamous Dealey Plaza umbrella be the signature of The Umbrella -- lifted directly from a gold bar?

 

Far-fetched?  Sterling Seagrave might not think so.

 

 

Fascinating, Charlie.

 

Could you explain your thoughts on the possible "signature" you see attached to the assassination?



#5 Gordon Gray

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Posted 22 March 2014 - 01:18 PM

For me a signature might be Ed Lansdale passing by the three Tramps.



#6 Pete Engwall

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 02:54 PM

I have never been able to calculate the odds for actual look-a-like people to stand together in a crowd of that many, giving the impression that they came to the Big Event together....


Pete Engwall

 


#7 James Richards

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 03:18 PM

As an aside, John Adrian O'Hare's son believes the man at the corner of Main and Houston is his father.

#8 Charles Drago

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 03:47 PM

It's good to have you among us, James.  Here's hoping you stick around.


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"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#9 Greg Burnham

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 04:37 PM

I agree, Charles. Welcome to the Forum, James.


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#10 Vasilis Vazakas

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Posted 16 August 2015 - 02:36 AM

Accidentally discovered this thread, although it is an old one. When Charles  sees a possible signature of the artist with respect to the umbrella man he probably refers to the black eagle trust and the 'Gold Warriors' as described by Sterling Seagrave. This would implicate Lansdale and possibly Napoleon Valeriano, a man that Charles have discussed in the past. Also people like Willoughby, Hunt, Helliwell, Conein etc. Garry Underhill's far east CIA would probably fit into this pattern.

Others might say that the umbrella was a reminder of the protection umbrella around Cuba during the Bay if Pigs that JFK never provided.

I thought that Lansdale was Charle's 'Thespian' or someone like Hunt, Phillips or Angleton. However i have the feeling that his 'Thespian' is probably C.D. Jackson.


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#11 Jim Hackett II

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Posted 16 August 2015 - 06:30 AM

Speculative:

 

Mr. Vazakas indicates the 'robin hood team' members. Some were the stone cold killers of others but IMHO not on this day of greatest 'secret' infamy.

 

The empowered killers were in my opinion only hirelings, professional to be sure but only hirelings. 

 

Hubris I think would fit the view of the cover and deception ops jerks as well as those deployed with weaponry. Hubris in even considering TREASON as an act of state for "the common good".

 

"It is all covered, we're good to go!" I can imagine the radio comm link clicking only once to relay the data for the go.

 

Silver and gold. And lead and blood in the sunshine.

 

All is covered as AWDulles was going to shape the apparatus of control with assists to the Chief Justice and the FBI (SOG) asshole(s).

 

I can't imagine a better alibi than photographs of the cover op team members on the streets of Dealy Plaza.

 

Unnecessary as events unfolded. The Patsy was killed the fable was written in advance.

 

Hubris enough to want a front row seat for the ultimate victory over hope, peace and a better way than constant WARS.

 

I've rambled enough without "proof", but sometimes the heart insists on an issue without "proof".

 

Pardon the interruption by speculation.

 

And Welcome! to Mr. Richards.

 

Jim



#12 Charles Drago

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Posted 16 August 2015 - 06:57 AM

Following up on the Charles Drago "Doppelganger Gambit " -

 

http://forum.assassi...e-photos/?p=108

 

Dallas, Texas.  November 22, 1963.   On the corner of Main and Houston, at 12:30 are these two interesting gentlemen:

 

It's been speculated the pair is William "Rip" Robertson and John Adrian O'Hare.

 

2hezqxt.jpg

 

I found this info on the duo on another site:

 

 

Thoughts?

 

 

Don't you just adore the Mengele twins look?  One light hat, one dark hat to enhance cognitive dissonance (as in white Mercedes, black Mercedes, dead blond princess; if it ain't broke, don't fix it).  One with, one without tie bar.  Clear color images would be informative.  But face facts (so to speak), it was a Doppelgang Bang in Dealey that day.


"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#13 Vasilis Vazakas

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Posted 17 August 2015 - 12:20 PM

Let's test the following hypothesis:

1. assume that Lansdale was part of the assassination plot

2. assume as many suggest that William Harvey was also part of the plot

3. If 1 is valid would Lansdale need Harvey to be part of the plot?would he trust him?

David Martin in his book 'Wilderness of Mirrors' describes the strained relationship between the two men:

Relations with Lansdale were no better. A clash between Lansdale, the guerilla fighter, and Harvey, the espionage agent, was inevitable...To Harvey Lansdale was worse than wacky. He was a security risk.

'Harvey seldom really talked to me' Lansdale said. 'He would never initiate conversations. It ws very hard to get information from him....

There are more but it is too much to write them...so if Lansdale did not like and trust Harvey why would he cooperate with him in the greatest of crimes? A man who was then in Rome, and an alcoholic? If their partnership failed badly during mongoose operation why would he be crazy enough to trust him with something bigger...assuming of course that Lansdale was part of the plot.



#14 Charles Drago

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Posted 17 August 2015 - 12:32 PM

... so if Lansdale did not like and trust Harvey why would he cooperate with him in the greatest of crimes? 

 

For many years, it was suspected that the Sino-Soviet split was a charade.

 

Or perhaps Facilitator Lansdale vented his spleen by setting up False Facilitator Harvey.

 

Or vice-versa?

 

Or Facilitators Lansdale and Harvey were ignorant of each other's involvement?  Or one knew, but the other didn't?

 

For starters.


"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#15 Vasilis Vazakas

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Posted 17 August 2015 - 12:42 PM

If Lansdale knew about Harvey's involvment

then i would guess that Lansdale used Harvey as a patsy because he was aware of Harvey's ZR/RIFLE program to blame an assassaination on the Russinas and Checs, he was aware of Harvey's connection to the Mafia and Corsicans, who then would become also patsies, as Lansdale and the CIA were trying to clear up Indochina from France's influence and replace the corsicans with Trafficante to control the golden triangle drug trade...



#16 Phil Dragoo

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Posted 18 August 2015 - 06:50 AM

They were trained.  And ingrained.

 

Allen was raised by secretaries of state.  Had countries under his tree at Christmas.

 

Phillips wrote a farce claiming Oswald took the Castro plot and turned it on Kennedy.

 

Which is what John Newman said was done.

 

Lansdale had famously led troops in greasepaint.

 

Dulles, fired, called in Hunt.  For a book.

 

Dulles in Dallas to discuss his book.

 

Touring.  On the Commission. In theatres telling Lifton, "You have nothing!"

 

The plays the thing

 

that slays the king.

 

aaf4hc.jpg



#17 Chuck Barlow

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Posted 18 August 2015 - 12:03 PM

Phil, you could have included a photo of a cockroach to provide contrast with a comparatively noble creature.



#18 Phil Dragoo

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Posted 18 August 2015 - 03:53 PM

So are they all, all honourable men—

 

2iu3lo5.jpg



#19 David Joseph

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Posted 28 August 2015 - 10:11 AM

So Phil...

 

Which in this group do you feel has the pull and power to get the Autopsy and body fundementally changed?

 

Who tells LeMay and Galloway and Burkley to play along... or was it the other way around...  the group of men in the image in your post represents, IMO, the protective wall surrounding the Sponsors...  I see all these people as Facilitators with a couple having close ties to the Sponsor level...

 

There there were those who were both Sponsor and Facilitator...

 

Harriman%20-%20Bundy%20-%20JFK_zps3nqvof


The Evidence IS the Conspiracy


#20 Greg Burnham

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Posted 28 August 2015 - 10:37 AM

Then there were those who were both Sponsor and Facilitator...

 

Perhaps you are describing False Sponsors, such as, those on the upper facilitator level. A dog has a tail and a tail has a dog. If the dog should lose its tail it will still continue to live. However, if the tail loses its dog, the tail will cease to live. By definition, Sponsors and Facilitators are separate.


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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- JFK

"It is difficult to abolish prejudice in those bereft of ideas. The more hatred is superficial, the more it runs deep."  -- Farewell America (1968) 

“The ancient Greek definition of happiness was the full use of your powers along lines of excellence."  -- JFK

"A wise man can act a fool, but a foolish man can never act wise."  -- Unknown

 

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