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The headlock

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#1 Larry Trotter

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Posted 24 November 2015 - 02:18 AM

I recently glanced at some of the TV broadcast on 11/22/'15 regarding the events of 11/22/'63, and I noticed, again, that the assassination re-enactment for the "Inside The Target Car" program had the 1st Lady, JBK holding POTUS JFK in somewhat of a headlock at the time the fatal head wound(s) occurred. That headlock appeared to have JFK "too low" for a "frontal shot" to strike him from the south knoll/Commerce St side of Dealey Plaza without going through the windshield and/or striking other occupants in the limousine. I now recall seeing that program before, and wondering about the positions of JBK and JFK when the head wounding occurred, and I suppose I thought maybe it was corrected later, but maybe not. In any event, after viewing the Zfilm many, many times, and the Nfilm many times, as well as seeing the Mary Moorman photograph, taken as the head wounding occurred, many times also, I have not noticed the positions of JBK and JFK being as portrayed on "Inside The Target Car" in any film or photograph. I also do not recall any eyewitness testimony indicating that "embrace". Possibly I missed something. Or, was there a major mistake made while re-enacting the assassination for the ITTC program?


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#2 Jim Hackett II

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Posted 24 November 2015 - 02:39 AM

Mr. Trotter,

 

ITTC and all the other media projects of the Disney/Discovery empire are nothing but junk. 

 

The Dunkle/Mack road show to our living rooms. It is all bunk.

 

Half truths, manipulations and out right lies are all we can ever expect from Mack, Holland, McAdams, Von Pein, Perry and the like LIARS - media whores IMO.

 

My reaction can only be to do my own thinking and reject the fable knowing the Emperor has no clothes, not even a loin cloth.

 

FWIW

 

Jim


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#3 Larry Trotter

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Posted 24 November 2015 - 02:39 PM

Mr Hackett,

 

 Thanks for the feedback. I just don't understand that re-enactment, but if I am wrong so be it. On the other hand, it is hard to understand how "professionals" can make a mistake like that, if that is the case. I would think that the "physics" of the murdering of JFK are quite well established, and have been for awhile.

 


Larry

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#4 Phil Dragoo

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Posted 24 November 2015 - 04:33 PM

Larry, you will find three reviews:  David Mantik, Pamela Brown, Jim DiEugenio:  http://www.ctka.net/...get_car_jd.html

 

As Jim Hackett states, Dunkel was into black propaganda--Black Lies Matter

 

After reading the trio I've linked, you find Inside the Clown Car is in a chop shop headed for Mexico with the balance to the crusher.

 

2hg7hab.jpg



#5 Ramon F Herrera

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Posted 24 November 2015 - 05:44 PM

I would think that the "physics" of the murdering of JFK are quite well established, and have been for awhile.

 

 

Far from it! Out of some 2,000+ books about the assassination, about 3 take the numeric approach. To make it worse, the Physics is about high school level.  :-(

 

Book authors have not noticed that the 21st. century has arrived. They are stuck in the late 80s.

 

There is only one group working to bring the most advanced science and state of the art technology to the investigation of the assassination.

 

You should read the following thread:

 

    http://educationforu...showtopic=22390

 

... and join the Education Forum (registration is by e-mail only).



#6 Larry Trotter

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Posted 24 November 2015 - 10:45 PM

Phil, 

Your response is much appreciated, and the link to the review is quite telling. 


Larry

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#7 Larry Trotter

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Posted 25 November 2015 - 12:24 AM

Mr Herrera,

I suppose I should have used a better choice of wording, other than "physics", when describing the re-enactment positions of JFK and JBK as shown on the national broadcast (again) of "Inside The Target Car" on 11/22/'15, relative to their actual position(s) at about 12:29pm/12:31pm CST on 11/22/'63. A wording short-cut, nothing more. In any event, I tend to believe that any re-enactment of the murder of JFK, whether staged with actors and props, or done with animation, correctness is absolutely essential. Good luck with your project.


Larry

Student of Assassination Research


#8 Charles Drago

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Posted 25 November 2015 - 07:06 AM

Far from it! Out of some 2,000+ books about the assassination, about 3 take the numeric approach. To make it worse, the Physics is about high school level.  :-(

 

Book authors have not noticed that the 21st. century has arrived. They are stuck in the late 80s.

 

There is only one group working to bring the most advanced science and state of the art technology to the investigation of the assassination.

 

You should read the following thread:

 

    http://educationforu...showtopic=22390

 

... and join the Education Forum (registration is by e-mail only).

 

And you should develop the research skills and expertise in deep political analysis sufficient to dissuade you from presenting unsubstantiated generalities as facts and endorsing JFK forums before you have investigated their well-documented liabilities.


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"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#9 Jim Hackett II

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Posted 25 November 2015 - 09:13 AM

Oh My.

 

Having been round the mulberry bush cyberly speaking and for myself, I tire of some places with not only the circular debate crews from Sunstein I would suppose,

 

but also seeming persons of agendae other than truth.

 

It is all too damn clear by now - the visible US Government is and was co-opted,subverted, screwed, blewed and tatooed. Further more it was so long before 1964.

 

Internet sites that still host and promote debate of already fact checked, vetted and sworn testimony under penalty of perjury  issues is beyond my ken.

 

David Lifton and Doug Horne have established pre autopsy corpse alteration to fit the Fable of invisible clothes and magic bullets.

 

They Have Done So in Factual Evidence ending debate about Z-Film veracity, about a helluva lot of other "issues". And they have done the job well, IMHO.

 

This material extends into many parts of the cover up.

 

Most certainly proving the Discovery/Disney MSM efforts are to be seen as crap unworthy of time.

 

"What did you expect from a pig but a grunt"?

 

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

Jim


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#10 Charles Drago

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 11:48 AM

Today I read on the JFK Internet forum previously referenced by Ramon F. Herrera that author's latest anti-science, narcissistic outburst:

 

"To be frank, when it comes to the use of Science [sic], both [pro- and anti-conspiracy] camps are still stuck -- or stuck still -- in the 20th. [sic] century and not even in the 1990s, more like in the late 1980s [sic].  That's a bummer. :-(

 

"The bright side ... is that the only ones pushing that boundary is [sic] us, the ones interested in The Truth [sic]."

 

Put aside, if only for a moment, what is revealed of this man's imagination and intellect by his use of the frowny-face, his feeble attempt at humor, and his problems with grammar and usage.

 

Herrera presents himself as a champion of the scietific method -- one who is adept at, or at least meaningfully conversant with, certain cutting-edge scientific disciplines.  Yet as demonstrated here and above, he routinely presents as facts vague generalities wholly untested and otherwise unsupported by fact. One is left to wonder if he is familiar with the concept that generalizations cannot be verified by confirming observations.  Does the term "falsifiability" ring a bell with this guy? Methinks there is madness to his method.

 

Further, he goes on to describe himself and his -- take your pick -- followers, acolytes, posse, and/or Merry Pranksters as the only legitimate seekers of truth in the JFK research community.

 

In terms of the former, Herrera all but disqualifies himself as a practitioner of the scientific method and calls into serious question the scietific legitimacy of the work he intends to produce here.

 

In terms of the latter, he can go fuck himself.


"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#11 Greg Burnham

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 12:53 PM

Notwithstanding Charles' expletive, these are most interesting observations.

 

As for the quality of the science, our resident physicists and co-founders, John Costella, PhD and David Mantik, PhD are both watching for the work if/when it emerges. They are not participants in it nor do they wish to be. However, if the work does not conform to acceptable standards of scientific inquiry we will be the first to know.

 

As for Ramon's self-proclaimed status of being among the "only legitimate seekers of truth in the JFK research community" I simply ask that he refrain from passing blanket judgments on the "rest of us." I would also like to remind him that a lot has been accomplished before his name was ever even heard. Indeed, in most JFK circles, including this one, he and his work are still very much unknown.


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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- JFK

"It is difficult to abolish prejudice in those bereft of ideas. The more hatred is superficial, the more it runs deep."  -- Farewell America (1968) 

“The ancient Greek definition of happiness was the full use of your powers along lines of excellence."  -- JFK

"A wise man can act a fool, but a foolish man can never act wise."  -- Unknown

 

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#12 Charles Drago

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Posted 26 November 2015 - 02:08 PM

Thank you for understanding the subtext of my expletive, Greg.

 

I used it to express, with maximum dramatic impact, my utter contempt for Herrara's dismissal of the work and sacrifice of so many who came before him and risked life and fortune in pursuit of truth and justice for JFK.

 

Conspiracy in the case of JFK's murder was established as unimpeachable fact decades before Herrara was around to stare into his mirror.


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"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#13 Jim Hackett II

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 10:22 AM

Now I find this just a little insulting.

 

"The Rest Of Us..." Now see here Mr. Herrera, One moment please.

 

Granted each person must conclude all for one's self in the Dark Politics Arena, but it is to me foolish to "set one apart" or self and friends set apart from the community in general.

 

Given the work referenced here/hosted here and the group of humans self associated here at "assassinationofjfk", it is to me a serious trespass to throw stones from a glass house.

 

Other than ending the Sponsors games, I see no "win" in the Dark Politics at all.

 

Division and destruction of unity of a community is the product of such a stance taken publicly of us=good/them=bad and the like..

 

Even if I were fortunate enough to produce "proof" and get it past all the MSM censors. To wave the bleeding monkey in front of the US Justice Department and see them indict based on my own information.

 

I would not be shouting "I DID IT!!!!",

 

it would be more akin to "Let's not get fooled again.....Meet the new boss same as the old boss.....DON'T GET FOOLED AGAIN!"

 

I have much confidence in "scientists" in some cases. I rest easy on the work devalued by others.

 

Including as important the work of Dr. Mantik, Dr. Costella and all.... plus the rest of "us".

 

Me? I just pay attention to the more learned than myself, when they show me humanity of perspective and truth in the scientific method as an engine of progress.

 

Jim

 

I still try to stick to the pattern of "attack the data, not the person", but it can be difficult sometimes.


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#14 Greg Burnham

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 11:12 AM

Thanks for your thoughts, Jim. Well said.

 

You said: "I still try to stick to the pattern of 'attack the data, not the person,' but it can be difficult sometimes."

 

Indeed, it can.

 

Admin note:

 

​Some would argue that I should have admonished Charles for his having invited Mr. Herrera to "commit unthinkable acts to his own self" on the grounds that said invitation is an ad hominem. However, it is also true that Mr. Herrera's having excluded the "rest of us" from the group of "legitimate researchers" is de facto an ad hominem itself.

 

Hence, I let it stand.


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Greg Burnham
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- JFK

"It is difficult to abolish prejudice in those bereft of ideas. The more hatred is superficial, the more it runs deep."  -- Farewell America (1968) 

“The ancient Greek definition of happiness was the full use of your powers along lines of excellence."  -- JFK

"A wise man can act a fool, but a foolish man can never act wise."  -- Unknown

 

Website:

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#15 Charles Drago

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 01:02 PM

Admin note:

 

​Some would argue that I should have admonished Charles for his having invited Mr. Herrera to "commit unthinkable acts to his own self" on the grounds that said invitation is an ad hominem. However, it is also true that Mr. Herrera's having excluded the "rest of us" from the group of "legitimate researchers" is de facto an ad hominem itself.

 

Hence, I let it stand.

 

For the public record, Greg:  Had you "admonished" me for said "invitation" for Mr. Wonderful to engage in an act not even John Curtis Holmes could have pulled off (oops), please know that I would have accepted your decision without complaint and with respect.


"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#16 Greg Burnham

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 01:53 PM

I know, Charles, and I thank you for that acknowledgment.


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Greg Burnham
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- JFK

"It is difficult to abolish prejudice in those bereft of ideas. The more hatred is superficial, the more it runs deep."  -- Farewell America (1968) 

“The ancient Greek definition of happiness was the full use of your powers along lines of excellence."  -- JFK

"A wise man can act a fool, but a foolish man can never act wise."  -- Unknown

 

Website:

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#17 Jim Hackett II

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 02:10 PM

I would second Charles in that if I had posted "over-the-top" then I would have had no issue with deletion.

 

I took a look over-the-top and a long gaze....only real, ... most serious! ... ??!....WTH?

 

I dropped the bs flag instead and posted in a few minutes.

 

But the post is as it got done. I'll stand by it.


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#18 Charles Drago

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Posted 28 November 2015 - 07:47 PM

Only of Science with a capital "S", esteemed Charles.

 

Could you please read these threads and cite ONE other project with the characteristics of the ones I am promoting?

 

If you find it, I will be more than happy to give them EVERYTHING that I am working on, and retire from this endeavor. Unless they accept me as a humble assistant, of course.

 

    http://educationforu...showtopic=22482   (DVP swallowed his tongue: not an easy feat!)

 

    http://jfkfacts.org/...#comment-828396

 

Last, but not least:

 

    http://simplymaya.co...ead.php?t=41914

 

    http://blenderartist...of-Dealey-Plaza

 

Make sure to notice the part where I mention The People and I state that we (that would be you, too) are making history. Unless you can find somebody who has preceded me (in this particular, conveniently and narrowly defined fashion), and I have not found. See post below.

 

Not to put too fine a point on it, but "Science" my ass!

 

Just a guess: English isn't your first language -- with a lower case "l", ignorant and arrogant Ramon.

 

Try as you might, I shall make it a priority to prevent you from walking back your ludicrous statements the likes of:

 

"The bright side ... is that the only ones pushing that boundary is [sic] us, the ones interested in The Truth [sic]."

 

The meaning of that statement is obscure only to the simple-minded and linguistically challenged.  In writing it, you willfully proclaimed unambiguously and with absolute clarity that you and your "People" [sic], to the exclusion of all other JFK researchers, are "legitimate researchers ... intersted in The Truth [sic]."  You painted with a broad brush and made no mention of any "narrowly defined fashion" until I called you out.

 

Now, exposed, you would equivocate -- except I won't allow it.  Not here.

 

Accordingly, I find neither your intellect nor your character to be worthy of trust, and I have no reason to expect that your science will be any more accomplished or honest than your language and judgments offered on this forum and elsewhere to date.


"[Y]ou can't blame the innocent, they are always guiltless. All you can do is control them or eliminate them. Innocence is a kind of insanity." -- Graham Greene, The Quiet American

"If an individual, through either his own volition or events over which he had no control, found himself taking up residence in a country undefined by flags or physical borders, he could be assured of one immediate and abiding consequence. He was on his own, and solitude and loneliness would probably be his companions unto the grave." -- James Lee Burke, Rain Gods

a wind has blown the rain away and blown
the sky away and all the leaves away,
and the trees stand. i think i too have known
autumn too long
-- e. e. cummings

#19 Jim Hackett II

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 04:34 AM

I await Mr. Herrera's revelatory exposition.

 

The last time I was instructed in the scientific methodology the "checking" is done by peer-review and tested by repeatabilty of predicted results tested again by peers.

 

As opposed to any other means of evaluation.

 

I await Mr. Hererra's revelatory exposition to be posted here abouts.

 

Jim



#20 Greg Burnham

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 11:14 AM

Fellow members,

 

Let's not kill the baby before it is born. Only then will we know if it is the spawn of Satan or an Angel.

 

Take a breath. Then dial it back.

 

Fear not: McMurphy is in Delivery and Nurse Ratchet has been tied up in a closet all day. The labor has yet to begin.


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Greg Burnham
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- JFK

"It is difficult to abolish prejudice in those bereft of ideas. The more hatred is superficial, the more it runs deep."  -- Farewell America (1968) 

“The ancient Greek definition of happiness was the full use of your powers along lines of excellence."  -- JFK

"A wise man can act a fool, but a foolish man can never act wise."  -- Unknown

 

Website:

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